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HomeMy WebLinkAboutThe Wingham Advance-Times, 1942-11-19, Page 1I. ST, HELENS COUPLE 50 YEARS MARRIED Mr. and Mrs. Wm, Humphrey Cele. brute Their Golden Wedding P" Mr. and Mrs. Wm. Humphrey gele. brated their 50th Anniversary of their marriage at their home, St, Helens receetly. Mrs. Humphrey was formerly Kezia Phillips, daughter of the late Mr. and Mrs. Ezekiel Phillips a.nd the marriage of 50 years ago was solemnized at their home at Old Fordyce on the 9th concession of ,Bast Wawanosh on Novmber 9, 1892, by Rev, Mr. Con- nor, of the Anglican Church, Lucknow. William Humphrey is a son of the • late Mr. and Mrs. William Humphrey of West Wawanosh. The couple' were unattended. Mrs. Humphrey spent her girlhood days in East Wawanosh and attended Old Fordyce school and also high school in Goderich. She is in her 73rd y-ear. Humphrey has been a farmer all, his life and with the exception of five years spent in Yellow Grass, Saskatchewan, had al- ways lived and farmed at St. Helens. He is in his 72nd year. They are both valued members of St. Helens United. Church, 'where they are regular at- tendants. The family numbers three, William of St. Helens, Mrs, George 'Walker of Wingham andt,Miss Lila at home. All were present for this hap- py occasion, as were Mrs. John Web- ster of London, Mrs. William Taylor of Guelph, Mrs, Cranston of St. Hel- ens, and Mrs, William Boles of St. Catharines and Mr. Middleton Hum- phrey of . St. Helens, all sisters and. brother of the bridegrooni, and two sisters, Mrs, Andrew Fox. of White- church and Mrs, Auca Phillips of Goderich and Ezekiel Phillips of A.11:7' burn, sisters and brother of - Mrs. Humphrey. Also present were Wil- liam Boles of St. Catharines, Mr. and. Mrs.' Arthur Clark of Goderich, Geo. 'Walker of Wingham, Mrs. William Humphrey, of St. Helens, and nine grandchildren. One grandson, Harold Humphrey, is serving overseas with the Perth Regiment. The dining room was tastefully orated with 'baskets of yellow and white chrysanthemums., The table centre was adorned by a three-storey wedding cake which was made by the bride of fifty years ago. A fowl din- ner was served to the twenty-seven guests by the granddaughters of this happy couple, Caroline, Greta and Mary Humphrey. Following the din- ner a social time was enjoyed by all. The numerous gifts were opened by the bride. During the day many mes- sages of congratulations were received, BRIDGE CLUB With Which Is Amalgamated The Gerrie Vidette amtWrexeter News. ISINgle Copies Five Cents WINGHAM, ONTARIO, THURSDAY, NOVEMBER 19th., 1942 •SUbscriptigns $2.00 Per Ygo I/ • TOWN NOMINATIONS MONDAY, NOV. 30th . Election If Necessary Will Be Held December 1st Preparations were, made at the ouncil meeting held Monday evening 'to hold a nomination meeting on Mon,- day evening, November 30th, from 7.30 to 8,30 p.m, Deputy- Returning .officers and'poll clerks were appointed. an electioin is necessary it will be ',held on Monday, December 7th, Bus Service To London Remains In reply to telegram that council has sent to the Transit controller they -were informed that Bus service in any -district would be judged on its merits. Council had protested any movement to stop the bus service south of -Wingham. Conn. Johnson informed the council That it was possible under a ruling for this district to purchase a ticket from here to London as formerly. A claim was presented by Miss Mary Pattison for the sum of $100. hiss Pattison fractured her ankle on Saturday when she fell on John street. "The matter will be referred to the insurance Company. • A number of acconnts were ordered -paid on motion of couns. Wilkinson .and Lloyd. The clerk notified the council that -the pavement debentures on John St. -are now paid up and that next year -the pavement debentures for all Main Street, Victoria Street, Diagonal Road, arid Alfred Street will be paid off. Next year the last of the debentures 4,on Howson's bridge falls due. The fire truck is now fully paid for he also informed the council. Coun. Lloyd reported that the perm- .anent staff at the cemetery had been -reduced to one man for the winter. Tenders for snow-ploughing were -received but nothing further was done in this regard as the conned wished -to make further. investigation in the tnatter of a truck. Coun. VanWyck brought up the -matter of doing some work on the fire- room. , Colin, Lloyd reported that he had received complaints that water which lies on McKenzie bridge is splashed -onto those using the walk by passing :motorists. It was decided that this was a nuisance and that the Dept. of Eighways would be informed. BINGO! BINGO! . A mixed Bingo will be held in the Armouries .on Friday evening, Nov- ember 20th, under the auspices of the Ladies' Auxiliary to the Legion, Play commences at 8,15 a'clock. 25 games for 25 cents. Chickens for specials, Play all evening for 50 cents. All 'welcome.. :Farmers Must Have Deer License There seems to be some misunder- standing, by some as to the boundar- ies for deer shooting in Huron this week, All Huron north of the south boundaries of Goderich, McKillop and Eullett townships has an open season. Farmers are required to have a deer license to hunt whether on their own property or otherwise. WHITECHURCH FLIER MISSING, OVERSEAS Ken Mowbray, Son of Mr. And Mrs. Robert Mowbray, Whitechurch Among Those Missing The R,C.A.F. casualty list of Thurs- day included the name of Alexander McKenzie (Ken) Mowbray, of White- church. Ken is the son of Mr. and Mrs. Robert Mowbray and they re- ceived word October 5th that he was missing ,after operations over enemy territory. The sympathy of this corn- ntunity goes out to the parents and his two sisters, Mrs. James (Cather- ine) Wilson of Whitechurehl Roberta at ,home and his brother, Angus, who attends Wingham High School,' ken was 22 years of age and prior to his enlistment worked with his father in the contracting business, He enlisted with the R.C.A. on the 15th of January 1941 and was stationed at Manning Pool, Brandon, He then %vet to Mossbank on general duty and in July retnustered: in the air crew at- tending a course at No, 2 Wireless SchoOl, Calgary, He received his wings as a wireless air gunner at Mossbank on January 29, 1.942, He was With the retry Command from that time 'until lie flew overseas it May. After arriving oVettetta.he took further instruetiOn and on September lst started operationat BATTERY HAD RANGE PRACTICE SUNDAY Firing practice Held At Ipperwash Camp Six officers and forty-nine other ranks of the 99th Battery under the command of Major Walter VanWyck were at Ipperwash camp ,over the week-end. Present also was Lt.-Col. George Howson, officer commanding the 21st (Res.) Field Brigade and Lieut. W, S. Hall, Brigade Adjutant. The battery left here about six o'clock Saturday afternoon and were stationed at Armouries at Forest over Saturday night. For most all members of the battery it was a great- experience as it was their first time to use live 'ammunition. Two 18-pound guns were used and the equipment was fully motorized. The battery moved out to the ranges at Ipperwash Sunday morning and after placing the guns carried on firing. The -results were, very satis- factory in fact the crews did excep- tionally well. Lunch was served at the gun positoins and dinner at the armouries at Forest. The battery ar- rived back .here about 11 p.m. The attendance at the Wingham Bridge •Club is holding up well. At the regular weekly game on Thursday evening nine tables took part in the play, The results were: North and South-1st., Mrs. R. S. Hetherington and Art Wilson; 2nd., Mrs. H. Green and Mrs. A. R. DuVal; 3rd., Miss Margaret MacLean and Mrs. Art Wil- son; 4th., Mrs. C. E. Richey and Miss N. Dinsley; 5th., Mrs. A, E. Van- Stone and Mrs. C. H, Magee. East and West—lst, Mrs. H. C. MacLean H. Crawford; 2nd., Mrs. 0. Colborne and W. H. French; 3rd,, Miss McCallurri and George Williams; 4th., Mrs. George Ross and C. G. Gammage; 5th,, Duncan Kennedy and Howard Sherbondy. Attending County Council Reeve J. J. Evans is in Goderich this week attending a meeting of the County Council. -Recently Arriver Overseas Word has been received here that Mac Groves recently arrived Overseas. Mac is with the Provost Corps. Fractured Wrist — Miss Sarah Farquharson fell in front of the Rectory on John St., on Friday and fractured her right wrist. The injury waS reduced at the hospital and then site was taken home. Sending Paper Overseas ' As the general public, are not al- lowed to send papers Overseas, the Clansmen Club of Lucknow are send- ing the local paper to the boys who are Overseas, The town council at Fergus is sending their local paper to the Overseas lads,, Marathon Bridge Games Started The series • of Marathon Bridge games held under the auspices of the Women's Auxiliary to Wingham Gen- eral 'Hospital, have got underway. Some of November games have been played and it is hoped that all games scheduled. for 'this month will be ar- ranged as sopn as possible. - Fractured Ankle Miss Mary Pattison, had the mis- fortune to fracture her ankle on Sat- urday afternoon. The accident hap- pened when Miss Pattison was return- ing to work ,after dinner, She was proceeding from her home on John Street and had reached the hedge at the Cenotaph when she felt on the slippery sidewalk. Eadies W. M. S. Meeting The home of Mrs, Ivan Haugh was the 'place of meeting of the Women's Missionary Soeiety of Eadies Presby- terian church. The meeting opened with the singing of a psalm and the scripture reading, the 25th chapter of Matthew, by Miss lean Wilton, The 'comments were given by Mrs. Gil- mour and Mrs, Geo. Day offered prayer. The roll call was answered by a verse containing the word Peace. Mrs. Thos, Haugh gave an Armistice prayer. 'A chapter from the book One Great Fellowship, was read by Mrs. Ivan Haugh. The Glad Tidings secre- tary, Mrs, R. Gilkinson, gave her re7 port and urged all to have their sub- scriptions in as soon as possible, The dedicatory prayer Was giVen by Mrs. Leslie Fortune, The Singing Of a hynin, The Lord's Prayer, and the National Anthem, brought the meet. ing to a Close. Lunch Was served by the hostess and a social time enjoyed: NAVY WEEK AND THE NAVY LEAGUE Next Week is Navy Week 'Through- put' Canada From Sunday, November 22 to Sat- urday, November 28 inclusive, boys and girls in the schools, adults wor- shipping in churches across Canada, listeners to radio stations across the Dominion, all will join in paying trib- ute to Canada's Navy, Canada's Mer- chant Navy, and to the brave men who without thought of honours or decora- tions or adequate recompense, are de- voting their talents and risking their lives to defending •Canada, fighting the enemy and delivering the goods to the fighters for, and defenders of liberty in almost every part of the world. The Department of Naval Services is co-operating to the fullest degree with the Navy League of Canada in celebrating Navy Week. It recognizes the gigantic task the Navy League has set itself in tender- ing to the material comfort of the men who go down to the sea in ships. This is the time of the year when the Navy League makes its general appeal to adults and children all over Canada for, funds to carry on its ever- increasing,., and growingly important work for our sailors, One hundred thousand sailors besides thousands more in Allied navies have to be serv- ed with comforts, with, club facilities such as given in its fourteen, Allied Seamen' Clubs, with reading matter, and ditty bags. Dozens of Sea Cadet Corps have to be maintained. It is a splendid work it is doing. We must support the Navy League! MAILING LIST CORRECTED The mailing list has been corrected up to and including Saturday, Novem- ber 14th. Please examine your label and if there are any errors please .notify this office at once. If you find that your label reads in arrears an early settlement would be greatly ap- preciated. Arrived Overseas Mr. and Mrs. Allan Pattison re- ceived a cable last week that their son, Sgt. Henry Pattison of the Sig- nals, had arrived Overseas. • Moved Here' From Teeswater Mr. and Mrs. William Austin of Teeswater moved here on Monday and are.residi•ng in the Johnston house on Frances Street which they have pur-. chased, Mrs. Johnston and family are living in the house on Shuter street formerly occupied by Bonnie Foster. Conducted Services Here Rev. Hugh Jaok of Seaforth con- ducted the morning service in St. Andrew's ,Presbyterian Church, At the evening service the special speaker was Rev. E. H. Johnson, a former missionary in Manchuria, at present in chaige of missionary education for the Presbyterian Church in Canada. On Monday morning he gave a very in- teresting talk to the High School stu- dents on the customs and habits of the Chinese people. Won Prize For Picture Rev, John C. Thompson of Arnt 7 field, Que., husband of the former Tena „Reid of town, . won the 19th prize in the Popular Photography Picture contest conducted by Popular Photography magazine. His picture was a color study entitled "Cold Morning", To win a prize in such a Contest is indeed an honour. The contest was opei-r to all countries where the magazine is distributed which means most of the world. HAIL STONES BIG • AS A HEN'S EGG They Measured Mine Inches In Circumference This 'story sounds almost like a fairy tale or at least Somewhat exag- gerated, but believe it or not it is true and we have a picture imi our window of the hail stories in question. The storm that produced these stones did not 'happen in this district, it swept across the 130issevain district of Mani- toba on September 10 this year. It Was a fierce' storm and the hail stones were as big as hen's eggs as, they measured nine inches in circumference. The picture showing their actual size was received here by Mr. Bert Weli. wood and it was sent to him by his sister, Mrs. Reginald Mckenzie, of BOISeevain, WINGHAM FLIER PRESUMED DEAD . Word Received By Mrs, T. C. King Saturday Mrs, 1 C. King received,word from Ottawa on Saturday that her son, Sgt. Observer George King, had presumed to have died on May 24th last. On May 26th a cable stated that he was missing after air. operations. . George enlisted in the R,C.A.F. in February 1941 and received his wings as an observer and navigator at Fingal in November last year. He was sta- tioned at Penfield Ridge, N.S., prior to proceeding overseas in January of this year. He was 25 years of age. On behalf of all this community we extend sincere sympathy to Mrs. King and her daughters, Miss Mary of town and Miss Kate of Sarnia. ST. ANDREW'S W.M.S. HAD FINE MEETING Peace "*as Theme Of The Meeting A goodly, number attended the monthly meeting of the W.M.S. of St. Andrew's Church on Wednesday of last week. Miss B. Graham and Mrs. W. Hammond prepared the program. The meeting was opened with invoca- tion and- earnest prayer for guidance by the president, Mrs. D. Rae. The Devotional period was conducted by Mrs. H. C. MacLean who chose for the Bible- reading Psalm 116-17 and MlissWilson who offered prayer. The Roll Call was responded to by a verse on "Peace" and Pdce being the theme of the meeting all hymns *ere chosen accordingly. The offer- ing was taken and dedicated by prayer by Mrs. K, MacLean. The topic "Ourselves Kept For Jesus" was ably presented by *Miss B. Graham. Mrs. H. Aitcheson favored the meeting with a solo entitled, Some Day we will Understand. "Italians in Canada" was well dealt with by Mrs. W. Hammond. The meeting closed with prayer by Mrs. .W. ,A. Russell, • Joins Princess Louise Fttsileers Eric Schatte has joined the Princess Louise Fusileers (Active Force). The battalion is at present stationed at Halifax and Eric left last week to join the regiment. He be a will solo cornet player in 'the band. ' Former Resident Passes Word has been received by Mrs. R. J. Tindall that her brother, George Hunter of Manitou, Man., had passed away in Morden Hospital, Norden, Man, following an operation. He was 76 years of age and was born on the' 2nd. concession of Morris. Fifty-six years ago he went to Western Can- ada. He attended a family re-union here four years ago. ,Mrs. Jerry Case- more of Turnbcrry, is alse a sister. 13ABY AND MISSION BANDS HELD PARTY Eleven Children Graduated To The Mission Band The Wingham United Church was the scene of an interesting event on Saturday afternoon when the Baby Band and Mission Band held their annual party. A splendid gathering of mothers and friends joined with the children for this festive occasion. Mrs. , Burgman, superintendent of the Baby Band was in charge of the program, and welcomed the guests. After the opening hymn,' Stanley His- eler led in prayer. Scripture verses were repeated by a number of Mission Band children. A solo was rendered by Ivadell Sparks and Ruth Burgman gave a recitation. Mrs. Wm. Field brought greetings from the W.M.S. and told the story of the Gift Box Children. A recitation was then given by Tommy Field. An interesting feature was the grad- uation exercise when 11 Baby Band members graduated to the Mission Mission Band, They were welcomed by the Mission Band children singing their "Welcome Song," Mrs. G. Howson presented the graduates with their membership pins and the chil- dren sang, °The Eniblem, of Our Mis- sion Band." The guest sp'eaker for the occasion was Mrs, Leslie Wightman, who pre- sented lantern slides, showing the latest adventures of the Seven Little Pennies, At the close of the program lunch- con Was served from 'a tea table, daintly decorated with pink and white candles- and mituis, FOUR INJURED WHEN - CAR 'LEFT HIGHWAY Accident Happened Near .Belgrave • Sunday Evening As the result of a car accident Sun- day night near Belgraye, Miss Rheatha Sinnarnon is in Wingham General Hospital suffering from slight con- cussion. Stitches were required to close a cut in her lip and her leg was also injured and she is suffering from shock,J Her sister, Marjorie, is un- able to walk as 'her knee was cut, six stitches were used to close the wound, her other leg was injured and she was otherwise badly bruised, Isabel Mc- Lean another Passenger suffered a broken nose and a sprained ankle. The driver of the car, William Lillow of Bluevale, suffered head injuries, His head went through the windshield and he would have been very Seriously cut if the glass had not been shatterproof. He also has his foot hurt and was considerably shocked. The car, which belonged ,to Mr. Fleming Black, Lillow's employer, was proceeding from Blyth to Wingham about 10 o'clock Sunday evening. Almost in front of Albert Bacon's farm, south 'of Belgrave, the car hit a rut and was thrown across the high- way and plowed into a tree on the west side of the road. The car a 1941 Chevrolet was badly wrecked in front. The bumper, grill and radiator was pushed back against the engine and the hood was 'buckled. The steering wheel was broken and the back of the front seat smashed. BLOOD. DONOR CLINIC HERE TUESDAY NEXT Word was received here that the Mobile Red Cross Blood Donor Clinic will be held in the Town Hall, here, on Tuesday morning next week, Nov- ember 24th. The committee will notify all who have volunteered of the time to report. Any who have as yet not handed' in their names and wish to do so get in touch with Mr. W. G. Hamilton, Bell Telephone Office. Preached At Seaforth On Sunday Rev. Kenneth MacLean preached the anniversary services in First Presbyterian Church at Seaforth. Small Fire At Foundry On Monday evening about 7 o'clock the night watchnian at the Western Foundry discovered a small fire in the brass room. Very little damaged re- sulted. A couple of floor boards were burned, Had Poem Published Last weeks issue of the Weekly Montreal Star contained a poem "Reverie of a Soldier" which was written by Mrs. A, R. DuVal of town, On Saturday Mrs. DuVal received a card from a lady in New Brunswick congratulating her on composing this fine verse. Extension Classes To Continue The lectures given each Saturday here by the Extension Department of the University of Western Ontario on psychology will continue as usual, -It was feared that it would be impossible for the lecturer to come to Wingham due to the new 50-mile linrit for bus travel. Official permission has been received for the lecturer to travel here by bus. 0th Line War Workers Busy The 6th line groups of war workers held their last meeting at the home of Mrs, Lloyd Henning. The quilt donated by Mrs. Bolt was quilted and .a splendid meeting was enjoyed. The next meeting will be held at Mrs, Robt, Breen's home on Thursday of this week, when Mrs. Wylie'. s quilt Will be quilted, The ladies are asked to try and be Present. SOFTBALL LEAGUE DONATED $43.81 Money To Be Used For Overseas Boxes The Softball Association made a net profit on the operation of the town league this year of $43.81, The money will be used for a very worthy purpose as it was turned over to the Women's Institute to swell their overseas box fund, Last year this association donated their surplus to the Women's Institute And it was used for the purchase of flannel for overseas use, The Softball executive are to be congratulated on giving their gulping funds to Stich Splendid War efforts. HUNTERS FLOODED THIS DISTRICT Deers Had TO Be 'Smart Dc Miss Hail of Boots The hunters did not waste any time getting out Monday morning, Huron being opened for deer shooting for the first time in years attracted many from outside and many farmers that for sometime had not bothered to bunt went forth this year as they had little or no distance to go from home. 100 licenses were sold in Wingham and it iE•reported that most all who had licenses for sale in this district were sold out. The number of deer shot up to the time of going to press was very large. A party from Lon- don headed by W. Taylor bagged four. Many others had excellent luck. On the first day Jim and Ralph Carr and others with them dropped three. Borden Jenkins, Ab. Lediet were credited with one as was Lloyd Cook and Sgt. -Malcolm Me,Canamon. Others who usually got their deer have not met with success up to now, RED CROSS OCTOBER SHIPMENT The following articles comprised the shipments to headquarters for the Red Cross Society: Hospital-12 sheets, 5 Russian sheets, 8 pair pyjamas, 6 odd pair of pyjama pants, 120 gauze h'dkfs. Navy — 17 V-neck long sleeved sweaters, 20 pr. socks, 4 pr. seamens 18" socks, 22 pr. seamens long stock- ings, 15 pr. whole mitts. Army — 5 pr. gloves, 6 helmets (ribbed), 19 sleeveless sweaters. Civilian — 5 girls„ sweaters, 14 pr. panties, 9 girls dresses„ 15 night dresses, 52 infants nighties, 44 diapers, 40 women's night dresses,1 child's sweater, 7 coats and caps. Miscellaneous — 1 woman's pull- over, 1 man's pullover, 1 woman's cardigan, 3 turtle-neck sweaters, 1 scarf, 9 pr. men's socks, 2 alternative caps, 9 large quilts, 1 crib quilt, 4 afghans, large. Institute To Meet November 27 The regular monthly meeting of the Women's Institute will be held in the Council Chambers at 3 o'clock on Fri- day afternoon, November 27. Father Ill Mrs. W. S. Hall is in Preston this week as her father, Dr. J. Scott Hogg, of Preston is ill. He is much im- proved we are pleased to report, Joins Canadian Navy Douglas Hoffman, son of Major R. W. Hoffman, overseas, and Mrs. Hoff- man of town, has been accepted by the Royal Canadian Navy as a Wireless operator. Fish And Game Club Annual The annual meeting of the Wing- ham Fish and Game Club will be held at the home of Mr. E. M. Snell, Thursday evening, November 19th, at eight o'clock. W. S. Hall, secretary; Geo, H. Orvis, president. Appointed To Staff Of Hospital Miss Lenora Higgins, Reg. N., is at present attending an Extension Course at the University School of Nursing, Toronto, prior to fulfilling the position of assistant supervisor of the obstetrical department of Victoria Hospital, London, Ont. Must Not Cash Coupons Ahead Of Time Merchaants who accept ration cou- pons which have not yet become valid are liable to prosecution. House- holders who give up such coupons mistakenly or otherwise, will suffer later, as they will get no more coupons until the next books are issued. House- holders are reminded that only cou- pons 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, and 6 have become valid, the latter two on Nov. 2. Coti- pons 7 and 8 will become valid Nov, 30 and Nos. 0 and 10 on Dec, 28, Horse Injured Had To Be Shot When a ear and a team collided on the McKenzie bridge about 1.15 a.m. -on Tuesday last week one horse was so badly injured that it bad to be shot. The car was driven by Wil- son Adams 'of 13litevale and he had as passenger Miss Dorothy Melporiald. The teat' t was being driven 'by the owner; tphriatri Parish and with hint was fames 'VraSer. The car waa pro- ceeding south and the team was go- itig north. The impact threw Mr. Par- rish over the guarding railing on the sidewalk. The Car a rod VS coach was badly damaged and the wagon Was wrecked. Fortunately no one was injured, Constable Gordon neyel lit- vestigated, . BATTERY IS NOW AT PETAWAWA ',V. The 99th Wingham Battery, R.C.A.' (Active Force) which has been sta- tioned at Terrace, B. C., for some months have been transferred to Pet- awawa. Preached At Exeter Rev. W. A. Beecroft preached at Exeter on Sunday. The Rev. A. B. Irwin of James St. Church, Exeter,. conducted the services in the United Church here. SCRAP METAL DRIVE IS IN FULL SWING Better Weather Should Assist Campaign The campaign to collect all the scrap metal possible in Ontario by December 15 is going very well in tlmis district according to reports. The heavy snow storms of last week no doubt would slow timings up some but now that the snow has disappeared every effort should be made to collet all the scrap metal and rubber pos-- sible. The need for scrap metal is most urgent and it is imperative that the controller get time information as to the amount of scrap metal that will be available. It is against the law for anyone to have over 500 lbs. of scrap metal in their possession, and anyone who has that amount or over will 'have to have. it moved by Dec. 15th. It is hoped that a 'concentrated effort will be made by all citizens during this period to dollect all the iron and steel that they 'possibly can as well as scrap rubber. The reeves and 'councillors of each township have the necessary inform- ation regarding the drive and to what constitutes scrap. If you require any information on this matter call your councillor or reeve.